March 13 2015

Quick Tips for Home Builder Marketing and the 2015 Home Buying Season

Home Builder Marketing

As home buyers begin to search for new homes online to prepare for the home buying season this summer, it is important to have your marketing ready for action. Now is the time to capture your spring leads before your competitors do.  Here are some quick and easy tips for making your home builder marketing ready for spring.

Knowledge is Power:

Not only will great content on your site help with your internal SEO, it is also an import tool for showing your homebuilder expertise to potential home buyers. Using blogs, email campaigns and social media are simple ways to show off your knowledge on home building and design. This includes creating a weekly blog post and promoting it on your social media profiles and email campaigns.

Make sure your blog posts are not self-promoting, but informational to home buyers. Create topics that answer home buyers questions like, “When is a Great Time to Buy a Home?” or “How to Start the Home Buying Process”. When you promote the blog within social media and your emails, show just an excerpt of the post with a link to your website. This will increase traffic to your homebuilder website and hopefully some home buyer shopping as well!

Capture and Use Your Leads:

Capturing leads from your website and having a CRM system in place to make sure your sales team is in constant contact with those leads is a must.

Catching leads can be done in several easy ways, with the most simple being the “interest list” or “contact us” form on your community landing pages. Note: always make sure to test that your lead forms are working properly, especially heading into the home buying season.

Another fun way to gain leads is to offer prizes or contest (a great blog post and social media topic as well). Home buyers on your site may be more willing to give out their contact information for a contest or prize giveaway.

Now that you have your leads, it is important to utilize them. Have a CRM system in place, as well as a sales follow up process ready. There are some great home builder CRM systems out there, for example, Lasso Data Systems, which allow you and your sales team to easily manage your leads.

Make sure your sales team is well trained and in constant contact with potential home buyers by phone calls AND emails. A good rule of thumb is to always follow up a phone call with an email or vice versa.

Warning: Your Website MUST Be Mobile Friendly!!

While 90% of home buyers begin their search for a new home online, tablets and smart phones have started leading in device searches. Because of this, home builders have started to integrate a mobile friendly website as a user friendly interface. BUT on April 21, 2015, Google will be releasing an algorithm update, known as “Mobilegeddon”. This update will hurt any home buyer’s website search rankings that are not mobile friendly!

User-Friendly Home Builder Website:

Here is another area that will not only help your SEO, but may increase your leads as well. Make sure your website is easy to use for home buyers. Many times the builder is used to their website and finds it easy to navigate; however the home buyer may beg to differ. Ask a family or friend to explore your website and get their input.

August 31 2010

How do you categorize your prospects?

Let’s play a game of Categories! In the Lasso game you have “New Home Buyer,” “Final Paperwork,” “Waiting on Go,” and “Just Looking”.  While with your current database you have “Level 1,” “Level 2,” “Level 3” and “Closed”.  With Lasso, you can name your prospective buyer’s ratings. While other CRM’s have it manual or pre set up.  Now you can have fun with your database, which in turn will make it easier to remember your prospects. In Lasso your prospective new home buyers will never be at a level where you question their meaning. You can categorize them appropriately as they are in the buying process. This not only makes it easier to glance and see, but for new sales associates, the ratings are easy to understand and don’t require a lot of training.

Make your Ratings fun and catchy! These are your new categories; you want to make sure regardless of who’s looking they understand both the buyers standing, as well as their view point. Some catchy ideas are:
- Window Shopper – Buyer is just looking around.
- Looking and Wanting – Buyer is looking and wanting to move forward with a specific plan.
- Ready to Start – Buyer has all the paperwork together and is ready to begin process.
- Ready to Move – Buyer has Paperwork completed and is waiting to move in.
- Home Owner – Buyer is now a new home owner!

Lasso Data Systems makes it easy to set up these rating. Here’s how to set it up in Lasso Data Systems:
1. Log in to Lasso – Go to the Administration Center
2. Click on your Client Name
3. Click on Project Name that you want to add the ratings to
4. Hover over “Real Estate” at the top of the page
          a. Hover over “Registrants”
                   i. Hover Over “Registrants Ratings”
1. Click on “Add Rating Types”
5. Rating: put in your first rating (ex. “Window Shopper”)
6. Add the Description (ex. “Buyer is just looking around”)
7. Click the “Save” Button

Congratulations! You have just created your first rating. Now you’re one step closer to making your sales process more fun and easily viewable.  From here you can click “Add New Rating” at the top, or edit your current ratings that you have.

Now implement. Have a meeting and get together with your team. Find out their ideas for categories and get your contacts set up. Now you’re creating an online sales process that works!

May 6 2010

Increase Leads By Increasing Engagement

Research done by Eyeblaster, Microsoft Advertising, and comScore shows that the more a consumer engages your website, the higher the conversion.  Eyeblaster's 'Global Benchmark 2010' report examined billions of rich media impressions and found higher engagement resulted in higher conversions.  An increase in 'dwell rate' from 5% to 15% resulted in a 45% conversion increase.  Dwell rate was defined as a mouse over or some type of interaction with an ad.

Image provided by eMarketer.

Research also showed that high engagement led to a 39% increase in brand-related search engine searches and there are many studies that show brand related searches have a higher conversion than non-brand related studies.

What this means for home builders:

In order to get a lift in leads, there must be ample opportunity for a consumer to engage you.

Ways to increase consumer engagement are:

  1. Good content - Site content should be comprehensive and relevant to the entire home shopping experience.  This means school info, utility info, neighborhood info, area info, etc.
  2. Add video - This is the easiest and quickest component to increase engagement.  Consumers love video - the constant rising video stats prove it.
  3. Have a blog - Post at least weekly and let consumers know the lights are on AND you're home.
  4. Have a Facebook fan page and converse with consumers.
  5. Have a Twitter account and converse with consumers.

Increasing consumer engagement takes time and money.  If you home builders want a lift in online conversions, you're going to have to allocate more of your budget to the online world.  From my perspective, as an industry, we're getting there slowly but we have a long way to go.  There is still way too much money spent on traditional media and not near enough online.  For goodness sake, all our consumers are online - spend the money there.  All the tools are here for us to succeed; we just need to use them.

Jim Adams - CEO


June 19 2009

The Consequences Of I Don't Know

“I don’t know”.  “There’s nothing I can do”.  Does anything make you more frustrated as a consumer, than when you have a problem with a company and they respond with “I don’t know” or “There’s nothing I can do”?

I was recently couldn’t check in on one of my Southwest Airlines flights.  I had no idea why.  I asked the attendant at the counter. “I don’t know why” was the reply.  I called the 800 number; again, “I don’t know why” was the reply.  I asked to speak with a supervisor.  Their reply was not only “I don’t know”, it also included “there is nothing I can do”.  I spoke with two supervisors – same answers.  I politely pressed them into giving me a non-published customer care number.  I did finally get someone who found out that I was on the Southwest Airlines terrorist watch list. I’m off now.

How backwards is that? I spend thousands of dollars on Southwest airfare each year, and they’re response is “there’s nothing I can do to solve your problem”?  I was ready to change carriers.

We’ve all been there - companies making it hard for us to give them our money.  Are you kidding me?

As consumers, we hear this all too often - so often that we’ve gotten used to it.  Those two phrases have quietly infiltrated our society and have become an acceptable standard that is slowly ebbing away our standards, our brands, and our profits. We’re so numb to it, we often times don’t even know it has permeated our souls.

If you’re in new home sales, “I don’t know” and “there’s nothing I can do” will put you on your company’s ‘Next To Be Let Go’ list.  

If you don’t know, you can’t help; if you don’t know, you can’t meet the need; if you don’t know, you can’t solve the problem; if you don’t know, you can’t relieve the pain; if you don’t know, you can’t produce.

The essence of selling is meshing solution with need.  The art of selling is getting to the need.  

What is that consumer really looking for?  Why are they there?

Everyone visiting a physical sales office today has already seen your homes online.  They are already familiar with your product.  But why did they take the time, get into their car, spent $10+ in gas, and visit you?

Are they really just looking?  Or are they looking for a home with a garage in a safe neighborhood because where they live now, their midnight blue ’69 Camero keeps getting broken into?

Are they really just looking?  Or are they looking to be as close as possible to their parents suffering from Alzheimer’s disease?

So often a consumer walks into our sales office and the first thing out of our mouth is “let me know if there is anything I can help you with”.  Another popular sales technique is to immediately barrage the consumer with all the fantastic features of the new home and the new home community.  

The goal of each new home sales person is to find out why that consumer is in that particular sales office.  This is called qualifying the consumer.  We’ve been spoiled.  For the past several years, qualifying the consumer meant “can they qualify for the loan?”  That’s not selling.  That’s riding the wave of insane consumer demand.  That may have been acceptable then, but it’s not now.

Consumers today have serious and legitimate needs.  With the housing market being as competitive as it is, we’ve got to find out what they are REALLY looking for - what’s most important to them.  

When a consumer walks into a sales office, how are they qualifying that home?  If you know that, you’re in.

But if we don’t ask, it’s impossible to know.  That’s the bottom line.

The number one trait in a successful sales agent today is asking the right questions in order to get to the core of why that consumer is in that sales office.

Sure, energy is important; sure a professional appearance is important; sure knowledge about the product and services are important.  But if you don’t get to the crux of why that consumer is in that model home, you will not know where they are in the sales cycle and you will not know how best to meet their needs.

As sales people, let’s surgically remove the lackluster standards of “I don’t know” and “there’s nothing I can do” from our lives.  

Consumers want their needs met.  They’re willing to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for it.  Don’t fool yourself.  They want to tell you.  Be a great sales person and make it easy for them to tell you.  Let’s say to ourselves, “I don’t know now, but I will politely inquire until I do know”.

Tip: a simple opening question.

"So what has you out shopping for a new home?", or even more simply, "Why are you thinking about buying a new home?" (Questions compliments of Jeff Shore)

If they say, “I’m just looking”, like many do, it’s time to get creative and keep asking.  They are not just looking.

Politely inquire until you know.

Jim Adams – CEO
New Homes

June 13 2009

Real Estate Of The Digital World

Last night at 9:00p and one second, PST, the Facebook land rush was on.  My pre-Facebook party consisted of Lisa Redmond from RedRocketLA, Mike Lyon, Ed Doss (NHD), and Ruth Kincaid (NHD).  We were all eagerly anticipating the NASA type of countdown and launch to get our Facebook domain.

Once the rush began, I immediately saw that jim.adams was available.  I elected to pass and search for the slightly better jimadams.  The search for jimadams was unsuccessful so I immediately tried to go back to the second best domain, jim.adams.  My heart sank as I saw jim.adams was taken.  Knowing domains were going fast, I quickly chose the far lesser of the two, jimadams1.

As I shut my computer and went back to watching Grand Torino with my wife, I was completely depressed.  I thought it would be a passing depression that would ultimately be just an evaporating disappointment.

I was wrong.  I woke up this morning still depressed.  Growing more and more introspective as to why I still felt depressed, it dawned on me.  It’s not that someone won’t be able to find me at jim.adams1 or that jim.adams1 will be THAT much harder to remember.  

It’s about the real estate. I was depressed because I got the lesser of the pieces of real estate.  Instead of getting the authoritative beachfront property, I got the small lot on the corner with only a partial view of the ocean – and all for the same price as the beachfront real estate.

It’s similar to getting the .NET domain extension instead of the .COM.  

The bottom line is, in the digital world, real estate is about the domain.  The domain conveys authority – or a lack of.  Domain affects consumer perception.  

Real estate becomes important when there are a lot of people in the same space.  Today, real estate is important on Google, Yahoo!, Bing, YouTube, MySpace, Twitter, and now Facebook.

I side stepped the desired jim.adams and lost it.  I now must settle for a second-rate domain.

No, it’s not the end of the world for me that my Facebook domain is second-rate.  I still have my most important domain, which has links to all my social profiles.  But my lingering depression made me realize that if you delay in the digital world, the consequences can be enormous and irreversible.  

Speed is king, not cash.

The idea of getting the most prized real estate should resonate the loudest with Homebuilders.  The same concept holds true in the digital world.  Unlike the physical world where the best real estate comes at a premium price, premium real estate in the digital world costs very little, and is given to the quickest decision makers.  Speed is king, not cash.  The spoils of digital real estate go to the quick.  The quick also happen to be the leading visionaries in the digital world.

The Internet is expanding at almost a ‘big bang’ rate.  Much of the talk I hear today is about how to monetize social media.  The bigger and more pressing issue is getting the digital piece of land.  Get the land and figure out later how to monetize it.  Homebuilders can’t wait until everyone knows how to monetize it.  It will be too late.  I know everyone has less money and fewer personnel.  A marketing person that knows the digital world is a homebuilder’s greatest asset to selling homes in the year 2009.

Jim Adams - CEO
New Homes

May 24 2009

.TV Is The Next .COM

You used to have to have special skills to publish content to the Internet.  Today you can set up a free blogging account with and be publishing within minutes.

You’ve seen the YouTube phenomenon.  Did you know there are now more searches on YouTube than Yahoo!?  Did you know you can publish HD video to YouTube?  I see the same trend with video as with what has happened with blog publishing.  

Hardware is cheaper.  Bandwidth is faster.  Bandwidth is cheaper.  Video creation software comes with the Mac and Microsoft Window operating systems.  The technology for publishing video publishing to the Internet is here.  It will get much easier and much cheaper.

Having your own TV channel is right around the corner.  Very soon you won’t have to publish your video on YouTube; you’ll be able to create your own TV channel just like you can create your own blog now.

Video is creeping up on us like blogging did and is going to explode.  Get your .TV domain now so that when you develop your own TV channel you won’t have to beg and buy your TV domain from a slimy domain broker.  Worse yet is to have your TV channel on a non .TV domain.  Having a video channel on a non .TV domain will be like having a .NET domain.  Ugh.

Jim Adams - CEO
New Homes

May 22 2009

A Consumer First Impression Is A Moving Target

It’s been said you only have one first impression; and that impression has a huge influence on future perceptions.  The evolution of a consumer’s first impression of a homebuilder has been a moving target over the last ten years.

A consumer’s first impression of a homebuilder used to be when he or she walked into the sales office and was greeted by a sales professional.  When we started using the Internet as our primary home search resource, the builder website quickly became the first impression.  And to a large degree the builder website still is the consumer's first impression, but it's still a moving target.  

A website is the face of a company, much like a retail store is the face of a retailer.  A consumer perception of a builder, or any company for that matter, is largely based on their web experience.  As technology has evolved, the web experience has rapidly morphed from a one page static brochure into a dynamic and rich experience with the incorporation of databases, animation, and an increased level of interactivity.

The web is now billions of pages with millions of pages added daily!  Consequently we have come to rely heavily on search.  Google has unquestionably given us the best search experience of any search providers.  They do it quicker and cleaner, with far greater relevancy than anyone else.  The phenomenal growth of the web and our dependence on search has made the first impression target move farther and faster than ever.

According to PEW Research, search has now become the number one Internet activity along side email. When it comes to the home search, we really have no other option other than to do a Google search.  Sure you may search MSN or Yahoo!, but with Google serving upwards of 70% of all Internet searches, Google is the search engine we need to be found on.  Yes, you can make an arguement about Yahoo! Real Estate or MSN Real Estate, but would YOU go there to look for a new home?  I wouldn't.  I've asked several people - they wouldn't either.  Obviously people do it, but it's not a natural psychological behavior.  The natural psychological behavior is to do a search.  Consumers don’t know the name of the builder or where a builder is building.  They only know where they want to live and their price point. So they search.

All that being said, a consumer first impression has now extended beyond the website to the Google search results page.  If your company is or is not found for a relevant Google search, it affects that consumer's perception of your company and it certainly affects your chances to connect with those home shopping consumers.  Being found on a Google search, whether it be a natural listing, a paid listing, or by being on a website that is in the natural/paid listings, has become business critical.

The consumer first impression has moved from the homebuilder sales office to the Google search results page.  Consumer impressions will continue to be a moving target because as technology evolves, consumer expectations will also continue to increase.  The web experience has now become the most important customer acquisition element to homebuilders.  Does budget spending reflect this? Not yet, but if we want to stay in business, it will – eventually. 

Have you heard that 90% of consumers start their home search on the Internet? 
Have you heard there are 200 million Facebook users? 
Have you heard there are 900,000 recorded blog posts added to the Internet daily? 
Do you hear it? 
That is the sound of inevitability.

Technology is not regressing and is not cyclical.  Just as builders have adopted to the consumer expectation of a website experience, we will also have to adopt to the notion that the web experience, whatever that means today and tomorrow, is now our first and most important priority in customer acquisition.

I continually hear stories where marketing departments are spending tens of thousands of dollars on a one day or one month print ad while at the same time can’t find half those dollars to breath life into a flailing or inadequate consumer web experience.  Builders are slashing Internet marketing jobs and budgets but still spend money on expensive and outdated marketing campaigns.  What’s up with that?

As a CEO in the building industry I implore other homebuilding executives. You can’t hide your head in the sand and hope this will go away.  If anything, the social media explosion should show us all that we have moved into warp speed with no intention of slowing down or coming back.  The Internet is NOT some side gig we’re doing for a small segment of our consumers.  The Internet gives us the best chance at being profitable with our marketing dollars. Spend your money and resources there and commit to delivering the best web experience to your consumers as possible.

Jim Adams - CEO
New Homes

March 13 2009

Google Voice - Another Free Service

Just read in USA Today that Google is taking another step in taking over the world - offering another FREE service to make our lives better.  Vincent Paquet, a senior Google product manager said within the next few weeks, Google voice will be available.

How it's supposed to work: Sign up for a new Google phone number (free) and then assign your phone number(s) to it.  Give out your Google phone number and when someone calls, all phone numbers associated with your Google number will ring.  Can't get to the call? No worries, the voice mail picks up and then the voice message is converted to email, and it will show up in your Gmail account. It works like the service but with a local number and it's free for calls within the continental U.S.  Internationals calls will come with an insignificant cost.

Google voice will also offer conference calling.

Check out

Jim Adams - CEO
New Homes

February 12 2009

Redefine in 2009

New Homes is redefining itself in 2009.  Playing in the shadows of the new home online media space for its first eight years, it's now time to let the world of home building know that we can help them make money through the online consumer experience.  Over the last year, we've completed our enterprise level back end of New Homes, we developed the building industry's press release website, we're just coming out of beta for New Homes Directory.TV, and we started the New Homes Professional Network, the second largest LinkedIn network of new home professionals. The NAHB's LinkedIn network is the largest.

New Homes is the only new home listing service of its kind - take a look at the design., after been breathing for 240 days now, is displaying 769 new home press and news releases.  Those stories have been viewed over 3 million times and have been found for tens of thousands of search terms.

New Homes Directory.TV is the first new home video site delivered in high definition.  We have completely redefined model home videos for music lovers by licensing hundreds of popular artists and songs.  Not everyone likes the popular music but the popularity of the iPod, iTunes, Amazon Music, Yahoo! Music, etc., tells us that music is important to a large segment of consumers.  Those are the consumers we are trying to reach.

Like everyone else, I have my strengths and weaknesses.  Consequently, New Homes has the same strengths, and it has the same weaknesses.  My personal greatest weakness through 2008 has been growth through sales - the sales process and the sales system (there was none).  As a result growth for our company has been sporadic and inconsistent, with little to no attention given to it from NHD from an executive level.  I have determined in 2009 that I will no longer let my weakness remain and I will certainly not let growth be a weakness of this company.

Personally, I have decided that I will sharpen my sales skill set and no longer let that be a weakness.  As a sponge, I will absorb the skills of some of the best in our industry - people like Jeff Shore and Mike Lyon.  I hope to meet Myers Barnes later this year also.  These guys know how it's done.

What does this mean for me personally?  What does this mean for the professionals of New Homes  It means change.

We will be implementing a much more growth centric system and process for our sales professionals.  Both Jeff Shore and Mike Lyon will be coming to train our sales professionals.  2009 is our year to redefine.  Redefine our company, redefine our practices, redefine our skill sets, redefine our standards, and redefine our expectations.

Today, Seth Godin posted a blog about algorithms, which he defines as a set of instructions that allows you to solve a problem. 

Here's part of his post. "Ideas that spread, win. Sometimes ideas get changed in transmission, and sometimes those changed ideas spread even farther and with more impact than the ideas that came before them.

In business, if you lock down ideas, make them difficult to change and spread and have impact, you fail. If you accept the fact that change is real, that there is competition for your ideas and that amplifying the good stuff works, you can grow and thrive.

Your organization (and your career) either embraces change and turmoil and sudden shifts in the rules or you fear it. In times of rapid change (that would be now), embracing the algorithm of the evolution of ideas and systems is a significant competitive advantage."  Read the power of an algorithm.

Here's a small tribute to Redefine in 2009.

Jim Adams - April Adams
Barbara Rossoll - Mike Sipes
Ruth Kincaid - Ed Doss
Gina Scott




February 7 2009

Shortsighted Responses to a Tough Market by Jeff Shore

Do you receive Jeff Shore's newsletter?  Did you read today's?  Check this>>

Warning: I’m about to offend people (especially managers) by challenging some of the decisions that are being made in response to market conditions. I’m prepared to deal with that wrath. But please, consider the message before shooting the messenger!

The challenging market means we need to re-think everything we do and every dollar we spend. That makes total sense to me; it’s just smart business to be as effective as you can, especially when it comes to cost cutting.

Unfortunately, far too many decisions are made in the fashion of the proverbial knee-jerk method. Critical programs are cut in the name of saving money, even though the programs are commonly revenue generating.

Time to re-consider some things. As an industry observer, here are four market response strategies that, I believe, are shortsighted.

Closing Offices

Ask any retailer on the planet about closing the doors to save on labor costs and they’ll look at you like you have a hole in your head. Retailers exist on one thing: traffic through the doors. Close the store and shut off your supply of traffic – it’s that simple.

A good temporary representative is an inexpensive alternative that can capture a prospect’s information and get that customer in touch with someone who can take them to the next level. At the very least, a prospect who takes the time and makes the effort to find a sales office will not be punished by finding the place unattended. Believe me, they’re not coming back to give you another shot at your convenience.

Good temporary representation will cost you a few bucks an hour, so you have to ask yourself whether it was worth the savings if someone pulled up, looked around and drove off. So try this little experiment: take some work or a good book and park in front of the models on a day the office is closed. Watch the look of your prospects as they pull up, get frustrated, and drive off. That might be all you need.

One last thing: some say that temporary representation is so poor that it’s not worth staying open. I disagree. I’ve met many of JoAnne William’s temps in new home sales offices who were every bit as effective (in many cases more so) than full-time agents I often run across.

Cutting Training

Okay – I know this sounds self-serving, but think of the reasoning behind this statement: “We aren’t getting the sales performance we need, so let’s cut the training budget.” Huh? Does that confuse anyone besides me?

It’s one thing if you are finding sales training to be ineffective. But good training should pay for itself with an immediate increase in sales. Training returns many times over in a direct increase in revenue, and a savings in incentives when salespeople are well-prepared to perform at the highest levels.

Piling More on the Sales Manager

Somehow the position of General Sales Manager has become the catch-all for the industry. I see sales managers who are totally consumed with meetings, paperwork, contracts, crisis management, customer complaints, and a thousand other details. And here is my question: Who is out there helping salespeople write more deals? Who is coaching? Who is challenging the salespeople to perform at the highest level? Who is making sure that incentives are used wisely, and that new prospects are given the opportunity to purchase?

We need to seriously re-think what our sales managers do. Their job should be focused on one overriding objective: Lead Conversion – making sure that every possible lead is converted into a sale. That job cannot be done from behind a desk.

Cutting Back on the Web Presence

If you see web advertising as a cost, you'll do what typical managers do - minimize the cost. If you see it as a money-making asset, you'll support it. When it comes to web presence, there is almost no justification for cutting costs in this highly efficient medium. The only question is whether the money spent is going in the right places.

For example, many search engine web sites charge you a monthly fee for placement regardless of performance (which is often difficult to measure). But using a search engine that operates on a pay-per-click model (, for example), you pay only if the prospect clicks through to your website – that is, you can track your costs in relationship to your activity.

In any event, cutting back on your web presence might be the most confusing of all the cost-cutting initiatives in place today.

But Jeff, our finance guy…

If you’re in sales and you’re reading this, and if you’re agreeing with some or all of these points, it’s time to put your sales skills to work in convincing the powers that be that saving money at the cost of making money is no savings at all. The business world is littered with the remains of companies that have attempted save pennies at the risk of losing future dollars. Sales and marketing is not an expense – it is an investment!


Jeff Shore provides new home sales training and is regarded as a top trainer of new home sales agents and new home sales managers.  Thank you for allowing me to re-post your newsletter on this blog.  This is great stuff. Jeff Shore has had a tremendous impact on my life as well as the lives of many others.  If you can catch one of his seminars, do it. The cost is little and the improvement of your skill set is great.  Check Jeff's schedule here.  Thanks again Jeff, Jim Adams.




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